Shaun Groves
Francis Chan is just a guy who pastors a large church in California. He’s not the smartest, most famous, most respected, most anything…I’m guessing. He’s just a guy. But the direction he lead his church in, or so the legend goes, is remarkable and unheard of. Or perhaps it wasn’t lead as much as allowed. Anybody know?
The story is – correct me if I’m wrong – that his church was on track to spend 20 million dollars to build a new building. What happened, and I don’t know how, was that the decision was made to build an outdoor meeting place instead. Much cheaper. Much much cheaper. And the money that was saved would then go to the truly poor around the world. And, the story goes, meeting outside on rainy days or hot days would serve to remind folks in the church of the discomfort others live in every day.
Spend less. Create empathy. Mobilize to show mercy. Sounds like church to me.
I’ve never met Francis Chan. I saw him in the hotel lobby in Austin a couple weeks ago and didn’t want to interrupt to say hey. But this weekend I’m looking forward to interrupting him just long enough to say thanks for the story and to get more details. Even if it’s not entirely true – what do I know? – it’s inspiring. What could church become? How does it become it? What is the pastor’s role in that becoming? Can it happen without him?
Here’s the video reportedly created by Chan’s church to explain why such a radical financial decision was made:
.
Cruz-Control says:
He told this story at the National Worship Leader Conference. He said that he told them it was repulsive to spend that much money on themselves, and he could never pastor such a group of people. He said that he, as a pastor, would be responsible for that before God.
He suggested that every time an offering was taken that it was divided equally – half spent on their church, half spent on others outside the church. This is the only way Christians can claim that they love their neighbor as much as themselves.
He said that if we really believe Jesus is starving (cf. Matt 25), then we can’t sit back and let that happen and expect to call ourselves Christians.
So, he told the elders it was repulsive to spend that kind of money on themselves when Jesus was starving on the other side of the world. He suggested building a park with an amphitheater that the community could use and they could hold services in – and would cost less money; the rest could be given away. When one asked about the weather, Chan reminded them of the Green Bay Packers fans who sit through a blizzard for the season every year. Packers fans are that dedicated for the team; are Christians that dedicated to sit outside in Southern California weather so that Jesus, who is starving on the other side of the world, can be fed?
His sermon was one of the best I’ve ever heard. An audio copy is available from the Worship Leader folks.
Lesli Bieganski says:
This guy and his church are an inspiration to me. As a missionary who is often discouraged by the lack of engagement of the American church to reach the poor and disenfranchised, he is truly a pastor to me through his podcasts, and he gives me hope that somebody “gets” it when it comes to missions.
His church, Simi Cornerstone, has committed to giving away 50% of what comes in at their church this year to care for the poor around the world – estimated to be $4 million this year alone. God bless them!
I’m pretty sure that is his wife, Lisa, singing in the video.
Zach Nielsen says:
Thanks for posting this Shaun. It’s very inspiring.
BUSH says:
Shaun,
we got the awesome opportunity to minister alongside Chan this summer at a Student LIfe Camp. Probably one of the best nights of the Summer. His message on the Bigness of God was amazing, and the spirit of God feel on that place. we had the chance to spend some time with him and hear his story. it’s all legit. that’s why i posted that video…for people to see his heart and the heart of his church…
his church also sent an Elder to plant a church in an area north of Dallas. over 100 members of his church sold there California homes to move to North Dallas to start a church. AMAZING. you and i both know, being texas boys, that a move from California to Dallas had to be a movement of God.
i hope you get to hang and listen. he’s just a humble man who brags on God. pretty amazing stuff. thanks for posting the video.
Mr. Police Man says:
Wow. The girl had a great voice.
This is so much like your compassion Int. connections.
RBerman says:
What a neat story! Thanks for sharing that.
RBerman says:
Incidentally, that video was clearly based on this inspirational and moving video by Sarah McLachlan, which explains how the $150,000 normally used to produce a music video was instead used for various community projects in the Third World: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzoNInZ2ClQ
crossdrivenradio says:
If you want to hear him preach, here is the iTunes link to his podcast:
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=74283811
Its very inspiring.
Andrew says:
I actually attend Cornerstone where Francis is the teaching pastor and have had the privellage of being part of this revolutionary church. The story is accurate I’m glad you posted it. The singer in the video is actually Francis’ wife, a great singer I might add.
Joanne says:
We’re members at Cornerstone and the story is accurate. It’s amazing what is happening at the church and it’s a blessing to be part of it. Yes, his wife Lisa is the singer in the video.
Nao says:
Hey you guys. Awesome job. Praise the Most High.
I was wondering if there are chords up for the song “Think of Me.” Is the music out also. I am very blessed by it. It would mean a great deal to me if someone does respond back to me..
Thank you so much.
Blessings.
Cherished says:
Nao~ Lisa just finished her CD with the song Think Of Me on it. You can contact Francis’ church in Simi Valley to have them get you a copy. All proceeds from the album are going directly to Children’s Hunger Fund. You will be blessed!!
Mitchel says:
Greetings Brothers and Sisters,
I had a question that I wanted to air out and get some feedback on. First off this is not a rip on Francis personally, but it I will say up front I am not a fan of passion and the whole movement.
I will be as gentle as I can with this question. I am not trying to be offensive at all even though it is a critique.
Why does passion (Francis Chan, Louie G etc) focus so much time and energy feeding poor people and making sure they have socks? Don’t get me wrong I think those things ARE important. However, I think the MOST important thing is the Gospel. The only way Africa is ever going to turn around is if Africa meets Jesus. Until then, no matter how much we feed them and make them wells they will be poor. Not just physically but more importantly spiritually.
It is my opinion that Africa’s greatest need is not a well, food or vaccines for aids. The CHIEF need of Africa is Christ! I just do not understand why the emphasis on feeding people is so heavy with this movement.
Please, dont misunderstand my question/ critique. I DO most certainly think we should do mercy ministry. My question is more about the emphasis placed upon feeding people.
I have not heard them “preach” about giving your money to sound missionary societies like Paul Washer with Heartcry. Or instead of bringing a pair of socks with you to a Passion conference, why not go into the city and share Christ with the poor people? WHy not hand out socks and give the Gospel of Christ? Cant you do both? Think of the huge impact thousands of Christians could make on a city if they are prayed up and out in the streets sharing their faith. The early church grew because they preached Christ and him Crucified.
Here is an honest question. What good are socks, wells and food when you are in hell?
In Christ,
Mitch
Bush says:
mitch – i’m not going to assume that you’ve never been to a country like africa where children are dying everyday from a lack of clean water…like you’ve assumed that Passion, Giglio, & Chan do all of this without presenting the Gospel. I think when you meet these people’s needs that is in turn presenting the Gospel. i also know that the Gospel is being presented in these situations.
I ask you to go to one of these countries (if you haven’t) where Children die everyday from something so simple as a lack of clean drinking water …or the lack of food…and tell them about Jesus without meeting their physical needs. you can’t witness to someone if they’re dead from starvation.
i guess i also ask people with questions like this to put themselves on the other side of the coin. put you & your family in a 10’x 10’ mud hut, no electricity, no running water, no toilets, and no meat…then tell me how you’d react to someone presenting you the Gospel without meeting any of your needs? i think we’d sing a different tune.
Shaun Groves says:
Mitchel, what is the Good News Jesus preached? Please site chapter and verse.
What is the “gospel?” Please site chapter and verse.
I appreciate the question and your answers are in these questions…I believe.
Mitchel says:
Friend,
I agree with you. However, you must have missed what I said. The emphasis is off…
I think we SHOULD feed people.
I think we SHOULD give them water.
However, I think we need to keep the Gospel Primary. I dont hear them ever bang the drum about the Gospel being central and most important. And I never see videos produced about evangelism. I see videos all focused about food, and temporal things. I think food is important but not nearly as important as the Gospel of Jesus.
Mitch
Mitchel says:
The good news Jesus preached is simply this.
1. Forgiveness of Sins
2. Wrath from God diverted and placed upon Jesus.
3. Right relationship with God and fear of death and hell are gone.
4. Because of the new relationship, and new heart Christians now have a new attitude toward life. It is manifested in acts of mercy, sharing the Gospel and conforming yourself to be more like Jesus Christ.
Romans Chapter 4
7 “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,
and whose sins are covered;
8 blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.”
Colossian Chapter 2
13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.
Jesus shares the Gospel in Luke 4 quoting Isaiah
18 “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me,
because he has anointed me
to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim liberty to the captives
and recovering of sight to the blind,
to set at liberty those who are oppressed,
19 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”
Look at the mission of Christ. He came to set the captives free. That is in reference to SPIRITUAL captivity. He came to give SPIRITUAL site to the blind.
Luke Chapter 19
10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.”
Notice Jesus primary mission. He came to earth to seek and save the lost.
Matt 1
21 She will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins.”
Jesus came to save his people.
I beleive the primary mission of the Church is to proclaim the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
The final command of Jesus was for us to evangelize and to make disciples.
Mark Chapter 16
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
I hope this is sufficient
Mitch
Cali Amy says:
Mitch,
One of the most important ways to share Jesus is by meeting what we call “felt needs.”
These are the things one is focused on. If you are hungry, you are much more likely to be thinking about your empty stomach than that Jesus died on the cross for your sins.
I know where Shaun is going, but even coming from a more traditional American understanding of gospel, most missiologists would agree that you aren’t going to get very far if you are not trying to meet the needs of the person. Meeting felt needs opens the door to sharing Jesus.
Mitchel says:
Cali Amy,
Thanks for the response. I understand the idea of meeting “felt needs”. I am just not sure I see that in the Bible. I understand the idea, and I am not sure if I fully disagree with it.
My main problem with Passion is that they put almost no emphasis on the Gospel of Jesus. They never talk about forgiveness of sins, imputed righteousness, justification, or Gods wrath being expiated. The focus is always on feeding hungry people or getting them water.
My problem is the emphasis. What is MOST important. What were Jesus’ commands? Did he say “Go therefore and feed the world and make wells”?
I am pretty sure he placed a high emphasis on forgiveness of sins.
Feeding people is good, but it is NOT the Gospel. Forgiveness of sins is the Gospel, and it must be primary.
I think this is a strong quote, and it is possible that this kind of movement can fall in this ditch.
“That’s the kind of missions trip where we make the world a better place for people to go to Hell from.”- Adrian Rogers
Mitch
Cali Amy says:
How do you respond to the Sheep and the Goats then?
Mitchel says:
I don’t understand your question.
Josh R says:
Matthew 25:31-46 Seems to end the question for me.
Chan preaches the Gospel (penal substitutionary atonement) in every service that I have watched. And his church supports missionaries that go to do the same.
Jesus didn’t say I was hungry and you didn’t give me a tract. He says I was hungry, and you did not give me food.
Nicole Parker says:
I just recently found Pastor Chan and his sermons online………the more I read and hear the more I’m impressed with the fact that this man truly is only out the advance the Kingdom……. not himself.
So I’m not suprised that he feels this way……………whatever happened?? Are they going to build a church at all??
Lena says:
Hey Mitchel,
I would have to say that I disagree with your statement:
“I understand the idea of meeting “felt needs”. I am just not sure I see that in the Bible… What is MOST important. What were Jesus’ commands? Did he say “Go therefore and feed the world and make wells”? I am pretty sure he placed a high emphasis on forgiveness of sins. Feeding people is good, but it is NOT the Gospel.”
First off let me say that caring for the poor and hungry is part of the Gospel…In Matthew 24 it says:
“For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in,
Mt 25:36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’
Mt 25:37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink?
Mt 25:38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you?
Mt 25:39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’
Mt 25:40 “The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.’
I believe if it is a command to us to do it, then we had better do it… Preaching the Gospel is great but that is not the only thing that God has called us to do…In Matt 5:16 God says “let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.”
Notice it said “Deeds”, that’s not just a bunch of words but “action”…Feeding the poor is an “action” that shows them God’s love…if we don’t feed them and clothe them then we are a bunch of big mouths with no action to back up what we say.
On another note…Nicole Parker…I attend cornerstone in simi and we are not going to build a huge church building but we are going to build an outdoor area that costs alot less money…You can see the architect plans on the website (http://www.cornerstonesimi.com)
Mitchel says:
Lena,
Hi there! I posted this a long time ago, but I guess I can still respond.
I would ask you to go back and do a little digging in matt 24. Who is Jesus talking to, and who is he referring to when he asks us to feed people.
Hint: The key is in verse 40 when he says “whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me”
A common word in the NT is adelphoi which means brothers. It is almost used in connection with believers. Jesus himself said “Who are my brothers and sisters but those who do the will of God”
I challege you to find Biblical support to back up your statement that feeding people is part of the Gospel. I personally think that is really bad teaching, and dangerous.
The Gospel is about forgivness of sins and eternal life. After we have been reconciled with God and are no longer his enemy we are changed people.
BECAUSE of that, we then go out and feed and help people. It is not the Gospel to feed people but it flows FROM the Gospel. Redeemed hearts care PRIMARILY about the souls of lost people, then their bellies. I see a monster shift in priority in evangelicalism.
Its all about wells and food, not about open air preaching, tracts and sharing the faith so God can save souls.
And you quoting of Matt 5:16 is not an honest proof text. I could argue that letting your light shine and doing good deeds could be a multitude of things. It doesnt have to be feeding people. And even if it did mean feeding people, that is not the Gospel it shows that we are Gospel people because we care about things like that.
Feeding people and doing good deeds is NOT the Gospel. Jesus never attached the two, and you shouldn’t either.
The Gospel is forgiveness of sins, and its a glorious Gospel, please don’t tamper with it.
Gail says:
Hi Shaun, good post albeit a tad late in me finding it.I was looking up Francis on google and I found you.
Mitchel intrigued me.I was a volunteer “mum” at Passion 07.Passion’s verse Isaiah 26:8 sums up speading the Gospel.Obviously Mitchel has never heard the talks form there or he wouldn’t be criticising the lack of any of them preaching the Gospel.
One only has to listen to Louie Giglio’s Unthinkable DVD or Francis Chan’s Lukewarm and Loving It to clearly hear the Gospel.
Good on them for keeping people alive to then share the love of Christ with.
JM says:
Mitch- With all due respect your a perfect example of a Pharisee. I can’t believe you need to look at the Bible for guidance on feeding hungry children and giving them clean water. Does God really have to put this stuff in the bible? Isn’t it just common sense? Of course they need the gospel, but for crying out loud they are starving to death. I can’t stand these Christians who argue about stuff like this. Use your head. Use common sense for God’s sake. It’s acts like feeding hungry people that spreads the gospel more than anything else.
“Here is an honest question. What good are socks, wells and food when you are in hell”?
“I challege you to find Biblical support to back up your statement that feeding people is part of the Gospel. I personally think that is really bad teaching, and dangerous.”
How can a so called follower of Christ make these statements? Saving someones life, or their childs life is the very best way to preach the gospel. The persons life you saved will remember it was a Christian that did this for them. What better way to preach the love of Christ than to act it out. If me or my child was dying and a group of Christians handed me a bible, but a group of Muslims gave me food and water, guess which one I would follow? Which one would I think put actions behind their words? Which one practices what they preach? If I had no religion which one would I start to follow? If we as Christians don’t put actions behind our words then we will all turn into a bunch of Pharisees. Any we know what Jesus thought of those.
Jesse VF says:
Isaiah 58:6-10
6 “Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke?”
7 “Is it not to share you food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter– When you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?”
8 “Then your light will break forth like the dawn, and your healing will quickly appear; then your righteousness will go before you, and the glory of the LORD will be your rear guard.”
9 “Then you will call, and the LORD will answer; you will cry for help, and he will say: Here am I. “If you do away with the yoke of oppression, with the pointing finger and malicious talk,”
10 “and if you spend yourselves in behalf of the hungry and satisfy the needs of the oppressed, then your light will rise in the darkness, and your night will become like the noonday.”
Love God by Loving people. Spreading HIS Glory in a needy, broken world. Preach the Gospel by your actions. How much will the rescued or the fed or the restored exemplify and demonstrate the love of Christ has for us ALL that HE would rescue us from the depths of our own sin.
Maria Luisa Segovia says:
In my country Colombia, and in all latin america, people are preaching and ‘spreading’ the gospel…I’ve seen people, with needs, no home, no food, no health…what is real gospel???The church is doing NOTHING…just the false promise of Jesus and his whealthy life…that’s a lie. To show the love of God…by the act of the cross, AND feeding the hungry kids, by conforting the victims of violence…that’s the face of Jesus…the LOVE IN ACTION!!!!!…These guys like pastor Chan has a real vision of the purpose of the church…
SwtMelis says:
When I think about Christ and his ministry here-he often met a physical need first before sharing his “good news” Also, since we all have spritual gifts-perhaps we need to respect some ministries may first meet the physical needs and then when asked why – then they can give the gospel-even with other ministries involved.
DHaynes says:
Let the naysayers cry, it’s all apart of the journey to New Jerusalem. When you have done it to one of the least of these, you’ve done it unto me.
Brett says:
Hi guys! What a great discussion – especially for those who have not resorted to name calling. I under stand Mitchel’s query – “Where is the gospel?” and I also understand the response “how can the gospel not include meeting the physical needs of those in our world who are suffering?”.
I was at a missions conference (I am a missionary) recently and Wes Stafford of Compassion was speaking. He said something I had never heard him say before. He said that Compassion leads 500 people to Christ a day. WOW! Now those who have been hard on Mitchel don’t start saying “I told you so!”. One thing that ministries like compassion often fail to do is to communicate how they also meet spiritual needs. They get much more response as they share about physical needs – especially from today’s culture. They see more response from Christians when they talk about a child who is suffering physically than they do when they talk about the spiritual needs. I saw kids flock to the compassion table to pick up a card to support a child. Would Wes have had the same response if he had said, “Who will sponsor a child’s spiritual growth and health?
It’s all about our own relationship with Christ because if that is not there then the outflow of that love we have recieved will not flow to those who need it both physically and spiritually. I’ll bet you a fiver that if Mitchel has a glass of water and someone else needs it he will give it to them because he loves Jesus. We don’t do ministry (both physical and spiritual) because of the needs of our world. We do ministry because we are filled with a holy spirit who is in the process of making us like Christ! And no one understands humanity’s needs like Jesus!
So the conflict rages because we have failed to keep both the spiritual and physical in perspective! When someone like Wes Stafford says a child needs our help we don’t do it just because a child needs our help – although that in itself is admirable. We do it because it’s what Jesus would have done and because we love Him. And we do it because of the hope that is in us! A hope of an eternity where suffering like we see in our world does not exist. An eternity made possible by the Gospel. Each man, woman and child we minister to in a physical sense gets a glimpse of eternity as we interact with them as Christ would.
“Now I make known to you, bretheren, the gospel which I preached to you,, which also you recieved, in which you also stand, by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. For I delievered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried and rasied on the third day according to the Scriptures…”
1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
If this helps – I’m glad! If not – my apologies.
Mike Ireland says:
I know this was a while ago, but thank you so much for brightening up my day a little. Its not often that we hear stories such as this – these days it seems that most people are just out to get what they can for themselves. Its great to see that Fransis Chan practices what he preaches and is obviously a very caring genuine person.
Bill says:
The lengthy discussion about feeding the physical body versus presenting the gospel of Jesus Christ highlights the central problem with the church today, DIVISION. Until we as “the church” come together in unity we will never fully realize the power that is available through faith. Really, what does it matter which comes first as long as BOTH needs are met. Does the act of giving bread from the earth first somehow make the giving of the bread of life less effective and does the giving of the bread of life first make the giving of the bread from the earth somehow less nutritous? Of course not!
Elysa Harvey MacLellan says:
Sharing this one at my blog! My life had already been pretty much turned upside down after visiting Swaziland last year. I read Chan’s CRAZY LOVE a few months later and it cemented for me a lot of what I’d been asking myself. I’m thankful for what God is saying thru Chan and I’m excited to see Christians around me getting passionate about loving God and loving others as they love themselves.
Keep up the great blogging and ministry, Shaun!
Elysa Mac
Nikki says:
Great discussion. I live in California and have been blessed to find Cornerstone. I knew nothing about Francis or Cornerstone. I was attending another church for a while but knew there had to be more.
I search for a church for two years and stumbled upon Cornerstone. I must say it was the only church that I had visited that when I read the bible the teaching really lined up with God’s word.
Every Sunday I would walk out going how in the world can I actually do this. It is definitely not a feel good church. You will be stretch in almost every area. But I wouldn’t want to be around any one less then people who encourages and inspires you to have an accurate picture of who God is while going out and sharing the Gospel.
I’m actually meeting my next door neighbors spending time with them hanging out building relationships and sharing the Gospel. I’ve been a Christian for a long time and only been going to Cornerstone for 3 months.
I haven’t read his book Crazy love yet but I think it’s funny that the word crazy is in the title. That’s what I thought about them when I first started going…man these people are radical and crazy. But in a good way.
I’ve never meet a group of people who love God so much that they would be willing to change everything in their lives to glorify Him. They don’t just talk about it…they are doing it.
Richard Barreras says:
Excuse me but did’t Jesus heal the sick, feed the hungry. Doesn’t it say that if you claim to be in union with him then do what he did or walk as He walk?
Just a thought folks
Richard
Richard Barreras says:
Just had another thought maybe we should read James Chapter 2
Then realize the from the abundunce of the heart the mouth speaks.
Richard