It’s the third most asked question on the road; right behind “How’d you meet your wife?” and “Do you have kids?”
Today, in fact, someone found my blog by Googling “Shaun Groves salary” – which is probably the query of someone wondering how much money I make and not how I make money, but it’s close enough.
We make money too important when we keep silent about it…so here’s how I get paid.
Record Royalties
I made three albums on Rocketown Records from 2001 to 2005. Every record contract is different but most conventional record deals charge the artist for a percentage of expenses incurred in making and marketing their music. Until those expenses are “recouped” the artist doesn’t get a dime from the record label. Like most artists, I haven’t recouped yet and may never.
Publishing Royalties
Publishers give writers an advance on their earnings when they sign a publishing contract. Once that advance is recouped from earnings the writer makes money. Congress sets the “mechanical” rate at around 8 cents per song per CD. That’s what labels pay the publisher to record each song. That mechanical rate is then shared by the publisher and writers – the split is determined by the publishing contract. I had a great publishing contract so I get 75% of 8 cents per song per CD on the three albums released by Rocketown Records. That money still trickles in.
Radio Play
Radio stations worldwide pay SESAC, ASCAP and BMI (called performance rights organizations or PROs) for the rights to play music to a large audience. I’m an ASCAP writer, so ASCAP does some convoluted math to estimate how much my songs are being played every quarter. Then they cut me a check. “Welcome Home” was a number one song for weeks in 2001 but “After The Music Fades”, a song that only reached number three on the charts, has paid me far more over the years. Radio money still drips in every quarter.
Physical Merchandise Sales
I buy the CDs I released through Rocketown Records for $5 to $6 each these days from the distributor. I buy my independently released CDs for about $1 from the manufacturer. Then I resell those CDs on-line and at concerts. When I started talking about Compassion at every show back in 2005, my merchandise sales plummeted. I guess that means I’m doing a good job convincing people they don’t need more stuff huh? But the little bit I do sell adds up and I couldn’t make ends meet without this revenue stream.
Digital Sales
The records I made with Rocketown Records are on iTunes and other on-line stores but those sales go toward recouping my outstanding balance with that label. I may never see a cent from those records. But my independent release Third World Symphony makes me $.74 per song when it sells on iTunes. I get to digital retailers through TuneCore, which charges me a fee for that valuable service. iTunes pays me the most and Spotify pays me the least. Without digital sales I’d be sunk.
Compassion International
I do contract work for every channel of marketing Compassion has. And that makes for some confusing financial records. When Compassion’s college chapel department sends me to speak at a university, I sign a contract with that department for that gig for the price that department pays speakers. When Compassion put me on this tour with Anita and Mark this month, I signed a contract with Compassion’s artist department for the duration of the tour and a set fee per show. I run Compassion Bloggers for Compassion’s internet marketing team and, same thing there: I sign one twelve month contract at a time to run that program for a set fee. Every year I probably have 30 to 40 contracts with various departments at Compassion for all sorts of projects ranging from graphic design to speaking on Compassion’s behalf at festivals.
Donations
Compassion underwrites my concert expenses so that promoters (usually churches) can book me for free. We don’t allow promoters to charge for admission so I don’t make money from ticket sales like many artists do. But sometimes promoters will collect an offering or make a donation to help us out instead. That helps me pay for airfares and rental cars and sometimes there’s leftovers too!
CCLI
Churches are supposed to pay CCLI for singing copywritten songs in their services. I don’t think that’s right, but I must admit I profit from it. I recorded an original arrangement of “Just As I Am” on Third World Symphony and have been amazed at how many churches have started singing it. And I’ve made a few hundred dollars from CCLI because of it.
Income for an artist is a river fed by many smaller streams.
Artists are usually operating as sole proprietors, so we pay a bit more in income tax than we would if we had an employer. We also don’t have insurance and other benefits provided for us by a boss. And we have payroll to meet. In my case, I pay one guy to handle booking and road management and my wife “volunteers” as my business manager – handling everything financial. Still, when it’s all said and done, after giving as much to our neighbor as we keep for ourselves, I live on less than a third of what I earn annually.
Every little bit counts. Same as you.
Jessica says:
Good to know. ๐
I was losing sleep wondering.
Shaun Groves says:
Someone was. It gets Googled quite often. You’d be surprised (maybe not) at what searches land people here.
Jessica says:
To this day Ricky Bobby lands the most searches on my blog. Not sure how to feel about that.
Rosco says:
Shaun, I’ve been working with a 3-can 6-pack most of my life with regard to how artists like you got paid.
I was friends with a very famous/wealthy artist (who was like a brother) whom I thought would show me the ropes of the music business as he promised. He died before he could.
Your blog which I actually Googled has been a great help to say the very least!!
I’m still in the blind, but not totally blind as I was 15 minutes ago! I’m a senior citizen. I still want to sell records, do concerts, everything I wanted to do when I was young.
Maybe I can ask you, or someone like you, to help me with specifics on questions and situations that I have with regard to my business.
Do you do music business consulting too? ๐
Anitra says:
Awkward. Meant to query whether you enjoyed celery….
Shaun Groves says:
Yes. But only with ranch.
Michelle ~ Blogging from the Boonies says:
I am glad to know this. After the post on your first world problems, I was using social media to try to convince people to buy your music. I was hoping it might help you out. I didn’t know how you actually got paid for your music, though. Now I know. ๐
Shaun Groves says:
Wow. Thanks, Michelle. It sure does help.
Katie Axelson says:
I’m always amused at what Google hits my blog gets. My personal favorite repeat: Are there anaconda in Nicaragua?
Making money as an artist sounds a lot like making money as a writer: it comes from anywhere and everywhere. I’m lucky in that my LLC has two employees: me (writer) and Dad (retired CFO) so I handle the words and he handles the numbers. If the business I do most of my work for paid me by piece, we may rival your 30-40 Compassion contracts. What a nightmare. I’m so sorry.
As for CD sales, I do remember the night I ran your merch table being amazed at how few CDs you actually sold. Am I reading this correctly in the best way for music fans to help you make money is to buy your CDs hard copy and directly from you rather than iTunes or another source?
Katie
Shaun Groves says:
I guess so. Buying my old stuff directly from definitely benefits me most. But buying my new independent stuff on-line or from me is pretty much the same benefit I think – comparable at least. That’s the great thing about being an independent musician.
Oh, and ARE there anacondas in Nicaragua?
Katie Axelson says:
Google it and I’ll tell you. ๐
(And thanks for pulling off the duplicate comment… a little overzealous on the submit button)
Terry Weaver says:
Dang it. I so thought you were getting rich from being a male model and spokesperson for the Target Men’s Jeans line. Thanks for clearing that up!
Shaun Groves says:
Not yet. Fingers crossed ; )
Kit says:
I feel like when a person doesn’t have a “normal job,” people are suddenly much more interested in this question. We raise support, like missionaries, to work at a full time ministry here. It’s….. interesting. Though I don’t think anyone has ever asked Google how much we make ๐
Shaun Groves says:
SO how much money do you make?
Don’t want you to feel left out ; )
Sarah aka MainlineMom says:
I hope you have a really good CPA. As a paid blogger, photographer and engineer married to another paid blogger and engineer, I know what multiple income streams is like and man, tax time stinks.
Your comment about giving to your neighbor as much as you keep for yourself convicts. It’s a goal of ours but only a more recent goal and one that takes some adjusting to get to.
Shaun Groves says:
My wife, in addition to being gorgeous and laughing at things I say that are not even close to being funny, is also a CPA. Score.
Jenn says:
This is a very informative post; it is weird what people want to know. My most frequent search term is “Francis Chan’s wife.”
I do think you could have made this a little more dramatic. Maybe you could watch the VH1 “Behind the Music” episode about TLC for some ideas.
Shaun Groves says:
Hmm, I need a duplicitous business manager to steal all my money, a super model wife to run of with my guitar player or…I’ll keep my boring life ; )
Jenn says:
Just have Becky set fire to some things in the front yard.
Karen says:
That was really interesting. Thanks! I’m sorry say that I have never googled you….I guess I need to get busy and start looking in to people’s lives more! ๐
I am challenged by the fact that you and your family have committed to give away as much as you keep. I pray often to be a good steward of what has been entrusted to us, but there are numerous things in our budget that I have trouble justifying…cable, smart phones…regardless of how “generous” I think we are!
Patti Welch says:
My question is not about salary but is: Has anyone else in the world ask you your name so you could get backstage? (Still wincing about that)
Shaun Groves says:
Happened tonight! Sort of. I walked up to the Compassion table in the lobby and the volunteer there asked if I was interested in sponsoring a child. “I’m about to ask this crowd the same thing.” ; )
Carol J. Alexander says:
Agree with Katie, it sounds just like a writer’s life. My top hits from Google? How to clean chicken feet and how to estimate the weight of a pig. Now you know where to go on butchering day. ๐
Brad says:
Props to you Shaun for doing what you do. I know it’s not easy. Bless you for following your convictions.
(Dang, someone interrupted me while I was typing that and I almost sent it as “following your convicts”. Imagine the Google searches *then*).
Shaun Groves says:
It IS easy. I pray often thanking God I’m not a roofer in Houston in July, or a middle school algebra teacher. That’s hard work! I sing songs and talk about Jesus. Piece of cake.
Brad says:
Good perspective, but I meant having to manage all those revenue streams and the potential stress of being self-employed (no regular pay check) isn’t easy. I’m trying to pay you a compliment man…just take it! :^) BTW, I have a brother who loved roofing in triple digit heat…weird, I know. I guess we all have our calling.
Danny Meeker says:
Thank you for this Shaun! It’s great to see that you’re open about this. I have some questions about CCLI: How does one register a song with CCLI? Is there a cost? If so, what is the “break-even” point?
Shaun Groves says:
There’s a link on the CCLI site. When I had a publishing deal the publisher registered songs for me but now that I’m independent I just registered them myself. It’s an antiquated process involving several pieces of paperwork and a fax machine. (Who uses those?) I don’t recall if there was a fee – so if there was one it must have been small.
Matthew (FzxGkJssFrk) says:
Shaun, I feel a little guilty for asking this, but I’m extra curious now – is your home paid off? It’s hard for me to imagine how that math could possibly work if it isn’t.
(Yes, I’m an expert at rationalization. Why do you ask?)
Shaun Groves says:
Nah. But our mortgage is cheaper than an apartment here.
Michael Clark says:
Where do royalties from online radio play get lumped in? Under “Radio Play” you only list the song and music writing portion of air play. SoundExchange probably has you in their system for online and satellite plays as the performer. I run an Internet radio network which plays Christmas music year-round and performance royalties are my highest expense. I’d like to think that some of that money gets back to the artists.
Shaun Groves says:
I do get paid by Sound Design but, honestly, I don’t understand how I even got signed up for it. I did let them know when my independent record released but I don’t know who registered my old label stuff. Sound Design pays less than ASCAP but every drop counts huh?
Yvonne says:
Very interesting and sounds like it could quite time consuming at tax time!
Brad says:
So, one piece of the puzzle I’m missing here then is…how do record labels make their money? I’m assuming that when you talk about them recouping their cost on the production of an album, that has profit built into it for them? Otherwise, if you haven’t seen a penny from those albums that means the cost of production and marketing hasn’t been recouped. So the marketing part is their slice of the pie then? Inquiring minds want to know.
Zoรซ says:
That last sentence was lovely – to know that where you have more than enough, you share. That is living life the way it is supposed to be lived. I am encouraged, as we move from financially ‘just enough’ to more than enough, to continue expanding our giving ๐
Joy Waters Martin says:
Wow ! Thanks for your honesty and open-book-life before others. It’s pretty refreshing –especially in ministry circles. My husband’s in the ministry — church pays him part-time and he is a roofer/construction guy on the side to make ends meet (if there ever is a meeting of the ends ๐ ) so I can totally appreciate the trickle down from various sources. I really pray God just pours out more and more in resources on you and your family — I know you’re not hoarding it for personal gain ! ๐ …you’ll just turn it around and benefit the Kingdom of God in some cool way ! I appreciate you and your family !
Rosco90209 says:
Shaun Groves, you have been a huge help! “How I Make Money”