First off, I totally agree that charging interest in our foreign aid to the poorest of countries is a bad idea and arguably sinful, but I think the chances of my idea gaining traction are about nil.  Partly this is because the Bible only prevents the charging of interest to non-Jews (at least that’s my understanding) and what constitutes usury isn’t always obvious.  For instance, most people laud Kiva as an

awesome charity (myself included), yet not only does Kiva ask for a 10% donation to fund their operations, but their average lender charges over 20% interest.  MercyCorp (a very reputable organization) charges 33% interest. Even Compassion International only spends 76% on actual child program development with 24% going toward sponsor/donor ministries, fundraising and administration.

This isn’t to say that the US is a good lender or that the charities mentioned aren’t fantastic (I think they are and have donated to all of them regularly) just that the more I’ve learned about charities and their finances, the more I’ve had to lower my standards.  It would surprise me if the same didn’t hold true for government bureaucracies

as well.

Honestly, since the Pope declared 2000 to be a Great Jubilee year and people started pushing for debt cancellations corresponding with the OT idea of a Jubilee year, I haven’t done much research on foreign aid and interest rates charged, etc.  If you have any sources for learning about usurous interst rates being charged, by the US in our foreign aid I would be interested in reading about it. After 8/9 years, maybe its time I took up this cause again and wrote to my congressman about

it.

Regarding poverty and terrorism, I would encourage you to read about the Bali, London, Madrid and 9/11 hijackers.  I’ve yet to read that a single one was poor.  Most of the 9/11 hijackers were the sons of middle class Saudi’s (hardly a poor country) and many were very well

educated with college educations in Europe and other western countries.  Here are quotes from papers written by a few profs at Harvard and Princeton which look at the relation between poverty and

terrorism.

“Using biographical data of 129 Hizbollah members killed in aramilitary actions in the late 1980’s and early 1990’s, they found that both having a standard of living above the poverty line and having a secondary-school education or higher are positively associated with participation in Hizbollah. Their paper clearly puts into doubt the supposed benefit of investing

in the eradication of poverty or in educational attainment as a means

of directly fighting terrorism.”

from http://www.irs.princeton.edu/pubs/pdfs/477.pdf

“Instead of viewing terrorism as a direct response to low market opportunities or ignorance, we suggest it is more accurately viewed as a response to political conditions and long-standing feelings of indignity and frustration that have little to do with economics.”

from http://www.krueger.princeton dot edu/terrorism2.pdf

Here’s another paper you might find interesting.

ksghome.harvard dot edu/~aabadie/povterr.pdf

MB

I understand what you are saying.  Poverty does cause a number of problems many of which you’ve listed.  However, I will not assume that even if it were possible to eliminate poverty that Violence, Hoplessness, Disease, death, terrorism, etc. Would vanish. To presume that it would is to deny the fundamental sinful nature of man.  Now, I believe that education, particularly literacy also plays a role in these things. 

Now, does that mean we as Christians shouldn’t do what we can?  Certainly not, but I would not be doing it because of potential enemies foreign or domestic, I’d do it because I felt its what God was asking me to do.

As far as going to see it, I see plenty of it here in Rural West Virginia, maybe not on the scope in say the Dominican Republic, or a hundred other countries, but I do have an idea of what it could be like.  As far as going to see it that, unfortunately takes money.  I doubt I could afford a one way boarding pass to visit any such country even if I felt the Lord was Compelling me to do so.  I told Bev the other day that some day I would like to visit a foreign country perhaps on a mission visit or a mission trip of some kind.  Right now its just not in our finances to take any trips, save to occasionally see my family.  It is what it is.

Should we want to help those who are impoverished, if we are able?  Sure we should, but we should do so with the Goal of being like Christ, and to draw folks to him.  However, no matter how much we might give to help these other nations, it won’t change that some people are sinful and are going to tend towards violence and/or terrorism.  Might there number be smaller if we could in theory eliminate it?  Maybe, but I doubt that there is anything short of the Lord’s return that can truly bring the cure to all of these ailments of man.  I give what I can, that’s all I can do unfortunately.  Perhaps in a year or two once I’ve gotten my own Financial house back in order the Lord will guide me to where to spend the increase that will be the fruit of paying off most of our debt.

Please, go see poverty, Veretax.  Seeing it is the greatest education I’ve ever received about it.

I don’t know the background of those hijackers – admittedly – but I’ve read stuff about the link between poverty and terrorism (and warring in general) and talked to two FBI guys, one who worked a terrorist bombing investigation once upon a time.  “Blowback” was a part of both conversations.  Part of blowback is the poverty we’ve either helped create or acerbated with our policies and actions.  “Usury” is cited, for example, by Osama as one of many motivations for his hatred of the West – loaning to the poor and then charging them interest, something he reminds us is forbidden by every major world religion.  Ouch.  Hurts when a terrorist murderer nutjob is reminding our government of its moral obligations and the Church is not.

Shaun,

I’m glad you clarified what you meant.  The quote below does seem to indicate that you do believe ending poverty would have made 9/11 less likely to happen.  I was merely questioning that idea based on the economic backgrounds of the hijackers (not to mention the ideology that motivates them).  I don’t think ending poverty would have made a wit of difference in preventing 9/11.

MB

“3. A child released form poverty by anyone(s) from the West is less likely, I think, to grow up and fly a plane into one of our buildings.  Self-preservation is not the primary motive I have for combatting poverty but it is a motivation I think even non-Christians and governments can adopt as their own.” -SG

God bless

Another way to approach the candidates personal commitment to alleviating poverty is to look at their own personal giving to charity.  This is easy to do, since they release their personal tax returns for major elections, going back as many as 10 years.

http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2008/09/biden-releases.html

Can you really believe that a candidate is committed to alleviating poverty when they have made several hundred thousand dollars a year for the last ten years and their charitable giving has varied between $120 and $995 per year (between .06% and .31%).  I personally find such a suggestion rather tenuous.  I would find a candidates claims about being committed to fighting poverty to be much more believable if they had done something personally to fight poverty.  Volunteered overseas or at home, sponsored a kid, adopted a kid, etc.  Personal involvement brings empathy and greater understanding, both of which help ensure the right solutions are proposed to effectively end poverty.

MB

Also, I think it is unrealistic to assume that ending global poverty would end the war on terror.  Most of the 9/11 hijackers came from relatively wealthy Saudi families and could never be classified as the world’s poor.

As to global poverty, I would love to see my country (Canada) and other larger countries focus on poverty in their backyards too, churches and governments like to focus on more of the socially glamorous areas and ignore the direct needs around them

The shelter/lunch program is in this link to give you an idea that it’s not so easy to do, but is necessary for the Church

http://www.canadianchristianity.com/nationalupdates/080403mayor.html