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	<title>Comments on: Greek to Me</title>
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		<title>By: Dylan</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14295</link>
		<dc:creator>Dylan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 02:15:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14295</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think the problem with this is that the focus is on the word eirene and no one really mentions the other word Poieo.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Together these two words mean Peace-Maker. Ok so we&#8217;ve found out what Peace means&#8230; but what about maker. In the greek it means to create, to author, to cause to be, to and simply to make.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Apart, these two words are used throughout the NT and OT in various forms. But together they are only used once in Matthew. It&#8217;s not enough just to say that because there are variations of the word used in other places that they mean the same thing.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
The place that this term in the greek society was see was on the coins along with the faces of Roman emperors. Emperors were called makers of peace because they were strong enough to unite and protect the countries they ruled. They did this through military might.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Now apply this to life.. If I am called to be a peacemaker what does that mean? I come up to 2 men in an argument how do I make peace? I get them to think about what they are discussing, talk about it respectfully, work out a compromise.&#160; Sure that will work most of the time. Sometimes they will just push me out of the way and punch each other. My friend pastor dave is very good at stopping arguments. He&#8217;s 350 pounds and can bench 450. He says to knock it off and people do.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
But take another situation&#8230; Hitler is committing an act of Genocide, trying to wipe Jews from the face of the earth. He has one of the most powerful armies along with powerful allies. Maybe I should go over and try to reason with him? My argument is that sometimes peace is only found on the other side of war.&#160; JFK said to speak softly but carry a big stick. He knew that in order to combat what he thought was evil, it take might. Just the way the world works.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Though I don&#8217;t believe that this verse is at all talking about Just War Theory or whether or not it is right to join the Army. Jesus said that we have an enemy who has come to steal, kill, and destroy...much like Hitler.. Satan does not want us to exist. We often believe that peace is just that funny feeling of everything going right. I agree with the views of the Shalom peace. But the fact of the matter is that if we stand aside and wait and watch while the world is going to hell around us because we want this funny feeling of everything going right then we are going to be eradicated.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
The bible states that we do not war against flesh and blood but against powers and principalities. I believe that the idea of a peacemaker is a call to war but a spiritual war fought with prayer and the word of God for the souls of man. I don&#8217;t know, that&#8217;s just my take on the subject of that word.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the problem with this is that the focus is on the word eirene and no one really mentions the other word Poieo.
</p>
<p>
Together these two words mean Peace-Maker. Ok so we&#8217;ve found out what Peace means&#8230; but what about maker. In the greek it means to create, to author, to cause to be, to and simply to make.
</p>
<p>
Apart, these two words are used throughout the NT and OT in various forms. But together they are only used once in Matthew. It&#8217;s not enough just to say that because there are variations of the word used in other places that they mean the same thing.
</p>
<p>
The place that this term in the greek society was see was on the coins along with the faces of Roman emperors. Emperors were called makers of peace because they were strong enough to unite and protect the countries they ruled. They did this through military might.
</p>
<p>
Now apply this to life.. If I am called to be a peacemaker what does that mean? I come up to 2 men in an argument how do I make peace? I get them to think about what they are discussing, talk about it respectfully, work out a compromise.&nbsp; Sure that will work most of the time. Sometimes they will just push me out of the way and punch each other. My friend pastor dave is very good at stopping arguments. He&#8217;s 350 pounds and can bench 450. He says to knock it off and people do.
</p>
<p>
But take another situation&#8230; Hitler is committing an act of Genocide, trying to wipe Jews from the face of the earth. He has one of the most powerful armies along with powerful allies. Maybe I should go over and try to reason with him? My argument is that sometimes peace is only found on the other side of war.&nbsp; JFK said to speak softly but carry a big stick. He knew that in order to combat what he thought was evil, it take might. Just the way the world works.
</p>
<p>
Though I don&#8217;t believe that this verse is at all talking about Just War Theory or whether or not it is right to join the Army. Jesus said that we have an enemy who has come to steal, kill, and destroy&#8230;much like Hitler.. Satan does not want us to exist. We often believe that peace is just that funny feeling of everything going right. I agree with the views of the Shalom peace. But the fact of the matter is that if we stand aside and wait and watch while the world is going to hell around us because we want this funny feeling of everything going right then we are going to be eradicated.
</p>
<p>
The bible states that we do not war against flesh and blood but against powers and principalities. I believe that the idea of a peacemaker is a call to war but a spiritual war fought with prayer and the word of God for the souls of man. I don&#8217;t know, that&#8217;s just my take on the subject of that word.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: emma</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14294</link>
		<dc:creator>emma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:11:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14294</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Just to throw in another strand of thought&#8230;
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
It&#8217;s been commented by scholars before that meaning is not so much found in a text as it is created, that we are active in &#8216;making&#8217; meaning from what we read. What if in this case we accept all the possible meanings?
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Jwise posted that long list of how eirene was used in ancient literature. I was struck by the phrase &#8220;In a state of eirene, there is no judgment, so mercy and grace are present with eirene.&#8221; So easy to overlook&#8230; but no judgement?? That&#8217;s huge! Never mind actually going to war, but we become so full of eirene that we don&#8217;t even judge?
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to throw in another strand of thought&#8230;
</p>
<p>
It&#8217;s been commented by scholars before that meaning is not so much found in a text as it is created, that we are active in &#8216;making&#8217; meaning from what we read. What if in this case we accept all the possible meanings?
</p>
<p>
Jwise posted that long list of how eirene was used in ancient literature. I was struck by the phrase &#8220;In a state of eirene, there is no judgment, so mercy and grace are present with eirene.&#8221; So easy to overlook&#8230; but no judgement?? That&#8217;s huge! Never mind actually going to war, but we become so full of eirene that we don&#8217;t even judge?</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: jwise</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14293</link>
		<dc:creator>jwise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jan 2007 04:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14293</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Jeff - very well put.&#160; I think our aiming to end war is taking the very tip of the iceberg of what &#8220;peace&#8221; (eirenes) really means.&#160; Kinda like thinking the Gospel only means forgiveness of past sins.&#160; Yet both mindsets are predominant in Christian circles.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Jesus had much more hope and faith.&#160; He speaks of a kingdom where, as you said, contention, strife, war, and all evil are a thing of the past.&#160; A kingdom where sin is forever destroyed and we who believe with him live for eternity with him.&#160; THIS is shalom.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff &#8211; very well put.&nbsp; I think our aiming to end war is taking the very tip of the iceberg of what &#8220;peace&#8221; (eirenes) really means.&nbsp; Kinda like thinking the Gospel only means forgiveness of past sins.&nbsp; Yet both mindsets are predominant in Christian circles.
</p>
<p>
Jesus had much more hope and faith.&nbsp; He speaks of a kingdom where, as you said, contention, strife, war, and all evil are a thing of the past.&nbsp; A kingdom where sin is forever destroyed and we who believe with him live for eternity with him.&nbsp; THIS is shalom.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14292</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:20:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14292</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thanks for double-checking the source, Shaun. I think you can still make your point using &#8220;eirenopoios&#8221; as it is used in Matthew 5 (&quot;striving to prevent all contention, strife, and war&quot;).
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
At the end of your original post, you wrote &#8220;If we could go back and ask the people on that hill side 2000 years ago what THEY thought Jesus meant, what would they tell us?&#8221; What if they said, &#8220;Jesus said people will call us the children of God if we strive to end all contention, strife, and war?&#8221;
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Think about that for a minute...not just the absence of war, but end ALL CONTENTION, STRIFE, AND WAR. He might as well have told them, &#8220;For truly, I say to you, if you have faith like a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, &#8216;Move from here to there,&#8217; and it will move, and nothing will be impossible for you.&#8221;
&lt;br /&gt;
Oh yeah, He did, didn&#8217;t He?
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Still no politics here but feel free to label me a &#8220;pacifici&#8221; - I give up. &lt;img src=&quot;http://www.shaungroves.com/images/smileys/confused.gif&quot; width=&quot;19&quot; height=&quot;19&quot; alt=&quot;confused&quot; style=&quot;border:0;&quot; /&gt;)
&lt;br /&gt;
Have a great weekend everyone.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for double-checking the source, Shaun. I think you can still make your point using &#8220;eirenopoios&#8221; as it is used in Matthew 5 (&#8220;striving to prevent all contention, strife, and war&#8221;).
</p>
<p>
At the end of your original post, you wrote &#8220;If we could go back and ask the people on that hill side 2000 years ago what THEY thought Jesus meant, what would they tell us?&#8221; What if they said, &#8220;Jesus said people will call us the children of God if we strive to end all contention, strife, and war?&#8221;
</p>
<p>
Think about that for a minute&#8230;not just the absence of war, but end ALL CONTENTION, STRIFE, AND WAR. He might as well have told them, &#8220;For truly, I say to you, if you have faith like a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, &#8216;Move from here to there,&#8217; and it will move, and nothing will be impossible for you.&#8221;<br />
<br />
Oh yeah, He did, didn&#8217;t He?
</p>
<p>
Still no politics here but feel free to label me a &#8220;pacifici&#8221; &#8211; I give up. <img src="http://www.shaungroves.com/images/smileys/confused.gif" width="19" height="19" alt="confused" style="border:0;" />)<br />
<br />
Have a great weekend everyone.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: jwise</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14291</link>
		<dc:creator>jwise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:05:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14291</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Shaun,
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Yeah.. so I grab Kittel tonight and go searching for eirene (no idea how to write it in English).&#160; I find the following:
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
A. The Greek Concept of eirene.&#160; Here it is &#8220;originally conceived of purely as an interlude in the everlasting state of war,&#8221; the opposite of polemos (war).&#160; Interestingly, eirene is &#8220;seldom used for concord between men.&#8221;  Instead, Kittel suggests, it means more a &#8220;peaceful state of mind.&#8221;
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
B. &#8220;Shalom&#8221; in the OT.&#160; The primary emphasis in the OT is on one&#8217;s well-being, &#8220;with a strong emphasis on the material side.&#8221;  Often the word relates to a group of people (especially the Jews), such that they enjoyed a time of prosperity.
&lt;br /&gt;
Also, shalom was purely a gift from Yahweh and cannot be viewed any other way (see Ps. 85).
&lt;br /&gt;
...
&lt;br /&gt;
There&#8217;s a discussion on shalom in prophetic messages and shalom as an element in eschatological expectation.
&lt;br /&gt;
...
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
C. eirene in the LXX
&lt;br /&gt;
Important to note that during the period of Classical Greek, nearly every occurrence of shalom in the OT was translated into eirene in the LXX.&#160; This means that the Hebrew shalom passed its meaning into the Greek eirene as far as the Jewish mindset was concerned.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
D. Shalom in Rabbinic writings (won&#8217;t bore you with this).
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
E. eirene in the Pseudepigrapha, Josephus, and Philo.&#160; In the Pseudepigrapha, with Enoch, for example, eirene means &#8220;the salvation displayed in the cessation of war.&#8221;  Interestingly, though, the opposite of eirene is not war, but the judgment of God.&#160; In a state of eirene, there is no judgment, so mercy and grace are present with eirene.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
F. eirene in the NT.&#160; Kittel says that eirene is very much like the OT shalom.&#160; This is evident when epistles are opened with a greeting of &#8220;Grace and peace&#8221; (charis kai eirene), just like the Hebrew greeting, Shalom.&#160; IMPORTANT: In the NT, eirene often refers to concord between men&#8212;this means eirene was redefined from the Greek connotations we read about above!&#160; Instead, in the NT, it receives more definition from the Hebrew understanding of Shalom.&#160; See Acts 7:26, Gal. 5:22, Eph 4:3, Jms 3:18, 1 Pt. 3:11.&#160; Also, Acts 12:20, 24:2, Mt. 10:34, Rev. 5:4 seem to use eirene as peace opposed to war.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
eirene shows these meanings in the NT:
&lt;br /&gt;
a) normal state of all things (1 Cor. 14:33)
&lt;br /&gt;
b) salvation of the whole man (Lk 2:14, 19:42, etc.)  eirene also parallels with Zoe (life), opposite of enmity toward God, judgment, and death.
&lt;br /&gt;
c) peace with God (Eph. 2:14-17, cf. Is. 57:19).&#160; This is a very rare use within the NT.
&lt;br /&gt;
d) eirene of men with one another.&#160; In a state of eirene, there will be no sickness, evil, or discord.&#160; Perfect unity and righteousness.
&lt;br /&gt;
e) peace of soul (Rev. 15:13).&#160; Only as God grants it, obviously.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Discussion then goes into several forms of the word; I&#8217;ll hit on just one:&#160; eirenopoios, because it appears once in the NT, in Mt. 5:9.&#160; Kittel holds strongly that Jesus&#8217; blessing was for those who come between two contending parties and try to make peace.&#160; God calls these men his sons because they are like him.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
So what does all this mean?&#160; There seems to be great support that eirene can NOT involve war because it is a state of existence where war has been purged.&#160; If we desire the Kingdom, then we desire peace/eirene.&#160; We make peace whenever and wherever we can.&#160; In doing so, we receive the blessing of being like God, and the blessing of the eirene we&#8217;ve just built.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Kittel has 21 pages on this one word.&#160; I&#8217;ve scratched the surface &lt;img src=&quot;http://www.shaungroves.com/images/smileys/smile.gif&quot; width=&quot;19&quot; height=&quot;19&quot; alt=&quot;smile&quot; style=&quot;border:0;&quot; /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun,
</p>
<p>
Yeah.. so I grab Kittel tonight and go searching for eirene (no idea how to write it in English).&nbsp; I find the following:
</p>
<p>
A. The Greek Concept of eirene.&nbsp; Here it is &#8220;originally conceived of purely as an interlude in the everlasting state of war,&#8221; the opposite of polemos (war).&nbsp; Interestingly, eirene is &#8220;seldom used for concord between men.&#8221;  Instead, Kittel suggests, it means more a &#8220;peaceful state of mind.&#8221;
</p>
<p>
B. &#8220;Shalom&#8221; in the OT.&nbsp; The primary emphasis in the OT is on one&#8217;s well-being, &#8220;with a strong emphasis on the material side.&#8221;  Often the word relates to a group of people (especially the Jews), such that they enjoyed a time of prosperity.<br />
<br />
Also, shalom was purely a gift from Yahweh and cannot be viewed any other way (see Ps. 85).<br />
<br />
&#8230;<br />
<br />
There&#8217;s a discussion on shalom in prophetic messages and shalom as an element in eschatological expectation.<br />
<br />
&#8230;
</p>
<p>
C. eirene in the LXX<br />
<br />
Important to note that during the period of Classical Greek, nearly every occurrence of shalom in the OT was translated into eirene in the LXX.&nbsp; This means that the Hebrew shalom passed its meaning into the Greek eirene as far as the Jewish mindset was concerned.
</p>
<p>
D. Shalom in Rabbinic writings (won&#8217;t bore you with this).
</p>
<p>
E. eirene in the Pseudepigrapha, Josephus, and Philo.&nbsp; In the Pseudepigrapha, with Enoch, for example, eirene means &#8220;the salvation displayed in the cessation of war.&#8221;  Interestingly, though, the opposite of eirene is not war, but the judgment of God.&nbsp; In a state of eirene, there is no judgment, so mercy and grace are present with eirene.
</p>
<p>
F. eirene in the NT.&nbsp; Kittel says that eirene is very much like the OT shalom.&nbsp; This is evident when epistles are opened with a greeting of &#8220;Grace and peace&#8221; (charis kai eirene), just like the Hebrew greeting, Shalom.&nbsp; IMPORTANT: In the NT, eirene often refers to concord between men&#8212;this means eirene was redefined from the Greek connotations we read about above!&nbsp; Instead, in the NT, it receives more definition from the Hebrew understanding of Shalom.&nbsp; See Acts 7:26, Gal. 5:22, Eph 4:3, Jms 3:18, 1 Pt. 3:11.&nbsp; Also, Acts 12:20, 24:2, Mt. 10:34, Rev. 5:4 seem to use eirene as peace opposed to war.
</p>
<p>
eirene shows these meanings in the NT:<br />
<br />
a) normal state of all things (1 Cor. 14:33)<br />
<br />
b) salvation of the whole man (Lk 2:14, 19:42, etc.)  eirene also parallels with Zoe (life), opposite of enmity toward God, judgment, and death.<br />
<br />
c) peace with God (Eph. 2:14-17, cf. Is. 57:19).&nbsp; This is a very rare use within the NT.<br />
<br />
d) eirene of men with one another.&nbsp; In a state of eirene, there will be no sickness, evil, or discord.&nbsp; Perfect unity and righteousness.<br />
<br />
e) peace of soul (Rev. 15:13).&nbsp; Only as God grants it, obviously.
</p>
<p>
Discussion then goes into several forms of the word; I&#8217;ll hit on just one:&nbsp; eirenopoios, because it appears once in the NT, in Mt. 5:9.&nbsp; Kittel holds strongly that Jesus&#8217; blessing was for those who come between two contending parties and try to make peace.&nbsp; God calls these men his sons because they are like him.
</p>
<p>
So what does all this mean?&nbsp; There seems to be great support that eirene can NOT involve war because it is a state of existence where war has been purged.&nbsp; If we desire the Kingdom, then we desire peace/eirene.&nbsp; We make peace whenever and wherever we can.&nbsp; In doing so, we receive the blessing of being like God, and the blessing of the eirene we&#8217;ve just built.
</p>
<p>
Kittel has 21 pages on this one word.&nbsp; I&#8217;ve scratched the surface <img src="http://www.shaungroves.com/images/smileys/smile.gif" width="19" height="19" alt="smile" style="border:0;" /></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: emma</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14290</link>
		<dc:creator>emma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 23:52:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14290</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Cruz-Control, thanks for the heads-up on that book, planning to pick it up.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cruz-Control, thanks for the heads-up on that book, planning to pick it up.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: jason_73</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14289</link>
		<dc:creator>jason_73</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 23:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14289</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;too bad that Origen took a sword to himself.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>too bad that Origen took a sword to himself.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bapster</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14288</link>
		<dc:creator>Bapster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 22:50:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14288</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Very good thread.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Can you make Peace by/through Peace?
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Certainly Jesus by disarming Peter de-escalated the situation, however there was much violence in the next several hours.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
I find my Fundamental Independent Baptist friends are very quick to dismiss the original languages. I&#8217;m delighted when anyone reads/studies their Bible. Having said that, other resources certainly can add to ones understanding.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Also, Thanks for the Book references, always looking for something to read.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Bapster (Dave)
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very good thread.
</p>
<p>
Can you make Peace by/through Peace?
</p>
<p>
Certainly Jesus by disarming Peter de-escalated the situation, however there was much violence in the next several hours.
</p>
<p>
I find my Fundamental Independent Baptist friends are very quick to dismiss the original languages. I&#8217;m delighted when anyone reads/studies their Bible. Having said that, other resources certainly can add to ones understanding.
</p>
<p>
Also, Thanks for the Book references, always looking for something to read.
</p>
<p>
Bapster (Dave)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Cruz-Control</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14287</link>
		<dc:creator>Cruz-Control</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:53:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14287</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Richard B. Hays, a colleague of Hauerwas at Duke, has got a great book called The Moral Vision of the New Testament (HarperSanFrancisco, 1996). He uses the social and literary context of the Sermon on the Mount and makes a good case for pacifism. He also address other ethical issue facing Christianity today is a very Biblical way.&#160; His pacifism chapter is called &#8220;Violence in Defense of Justice.&#8221;  Quite excellent and scholarly sound.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
I used this book for a paper on Christian pacifism.&#160; You might want to check it out.
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard B. Hays, a colleague of Hauerwas at Duke, has got a great book called The Moral Vision of the New Testament (HarperSanFrancisco, 1996). He uses the social and literary context of the Sermon on the Mount and makes a good case for pacifism. He also address other ethical issue facing Christianity today is a very Biblical way.&nbsp; His pacifism chapter is called &#8220;Violence in Defense of Justice.&#8221;  Quite excellent and scholarly sound.
</p>
<p>
I used this book for a paper on Christian pacifism.&nbsp; You might want to check it out.</p>
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		<title>By: Shawn</title>
		<link>http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14286</link>
		<dc:creator>Shawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:23:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shaungroves.com/2007/01/greek-to-me/#comment-14286</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I first want to clarify to jwise and Jeff that I am not a Democrat. Seond, I served four years in the U.S.Army and I did so because I thought I was supposed to &#8220;serve my country&#8221;. Third, there is no denying that there isn&#8217;t a blind support of a certain politcal party in the modern Amrican evangelical church, inwhich a pastor will give his opinion from the podium and the congregation will take his word as law, doing what he thinks is right. I have come to the conclusion that while I have been blessed by being born and growing up here (in the states) but I am a citizen of a bigger Kingdom and I realize this now. To quote a Switchfoot song &#8220;I pledge allegence to a country without borders, without politicians...&#8221;. I also have the conviction that like Shaun, being a more intelligent writter than myself, that we cannot make peace by war. There is a simple factor in this equation and the Iraq war is a great emaple. While going into Iraq maybe have been a noble, just idea, the end result is simple, we looked at the future outcome to be what would happen if everyone knew Jesus. Fact of the matter is muslims don&#8217;t know Jesus as their savior, so a positive outcome will never happen. And incase anyone was wondering if I am a passivist, hit someone who cannot defend themselves infront of me and see how passive I am.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Peace(I say this in a genuine way) Shawn
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I first want to clarify to jwise and Jeff that I am not a Democrat. Seond, I served four years in the U.S.Army and I did so because I thought I was supposed to &#8220;serve my country&#8221;. Third, there is no denying that there isn&#8217;t a blind support of a certain politcal party in the modern Amrican evangelical church, inwhich a pastor will give his opinion from the podium and the congregation will take his word as law, doing what he thinks is right. I have come to the conclusion that while I have been blessed by being born and growing up here (in the states) but I am a citizen of a bigger Kingdom and I realize this now. To quote a Switchfoot song &#8220;I pledge allegence to a country without borders, without politicians&#8230;&#8221;. I also have the conviction that like Shaun, being a more intelligent writter than myself, that we cannot make peace by war. There is a simple factor in this equation and the Iraq war is a great emaple. While going into Iraq maybe have been a noble, just idea, the end result is simple, we looked at the future outcome to be what would happen if everyone knew Jesus. Fact of the matter is muslims don&#8217;t know Jesus as their savior, so a positive outcome will never happen. And incase anyone was wondering if I am a passivist, hit someone who cannot defend themselves infront of me and see how passive I am.
</p>
<p>
Peace(I say this in a genuine way) Shawn</p>
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